Futuristic VTPR slope aerobatics
The above is a frontside 360* air performed by a surfer. Pretty sweet move, until recently mostly seen only in skateboarding and snowboarding. So what’s the relation to VTPR (Voltige Très Près du Relief) aerobatics?
Well, the question is, where do we go from here in our VTPR flying?
Last summer was tremendously exciting for the US VTPR aerobatics movement. In the span of just a few months, we saw “Swiss Peter” Richner’s revolutionary ultralightweight “Swiss Fish” building techniques combined with my Le Fish VTPR glider and Benoit Paysant Le Roux’s Madslide elevator. The resulting airframe enabled some truly new things be done in VTPR aerobatics: for the first time, we were able to start doing completely controlled Madflight at extremely low VTPR altitudes in very light lift conditions. Pierre Rondel called it alternatively “underground VTPR” (because of how low we are flying) and “ultimate VTPR”. For his part, BPLR was very pleased to see new development in this area. Super fun!!
Next Dawson Henderson showed us the way towards a reliable, repeatable means of getting Madflight flips on tap via his innovative pulley system. Paige Anderson of Future Slope Designs started working on a chain drive system that shows promise to do the same for his Axis-60 and Axis-72 VTPR gliders. John “Big Gas” Scahill and Dan McCleary have started expanding the palette beyond the Le Fish with their Mad-Extra and DoDo designs. Swiss Peter has started development of his own unique designs which he calls the Swissfish.
In the right hands, all of these nearly indestructible EPP planes can be flown to new limits, with Madflight seamlessly integrated into more traditional VTPR passes and traditional higher altitude slope aerobatics figures, all with good speed and energy management. Finally, a cool synthesis of three popular trends in slope aerobatics over the past 10 years or so!
Great, now what?
Two immediate goals: knife edge loops, and yaw flips aka “pinwheels” (see the surfer video for an example of the latter). Performed as part of a VTPR sequence that incorporated Madflight flips, this could lead to some of the craziest – and coolest – VTPR aerobatics flying ever seen on the slope.
The question is, can our current gliders perform these maneuvers, or will they require radical revision? Increases in side area generally result in increased drag regardless of how it’s implemented, and this can result in loss of energy and possibly make these figures impossible. Conversely, yaw flips may require a reduction in side area, or a change in where it is located – possibly imperiling not only knife edge loops, but traditional knife edge flight, too. As always the trick will be finding the right balance between design and technique to pull these figures off. Can we find one design which can do it all?
So what do you think, are these moves even possible with a VTPR glider? What figures would you like to see attempted? What do you dream of? Leave a comment and let’s see what happens.
5 thoughts on “Futuristic VTPR slope aerobatics”
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I Steve,
As already discussed in a french forum, I think some things can be exploited from skateboarding and snowboarding universes. But some of these capabilities will certainly requiere some revision of the design of these gliders… And there is a first issue here, because for lot of us, a glider is a beautifull thing, and some of these modifications should alterated this beauty.
For example: Fakie. Thats something I think never seen on gliders, because totally incompatible with the current designs, but not impossible I guess. With a doule tailed design (like for a snowboard) it should be possible. But would be an extreme modification leading to an ugly thing.
More reasonnably I think some area need to be dig. For example using the mad elevator concept to full incidence wings. Or/and to a full incidence rudder for some more extrem flat manoeuvres. These modification would open a way to some extrem flying attitude or some extrem stalling manoeuvers.
Also the static contact with the ground, , like the equilibrium on the wing found in the kite’s world, wich would requiere a fonctionnal “air break” to maintain a precise speed in the wind (like with crows).
Also all the moving contact with a surface can be exploited further, like all the rock slides of skateboarding, we already seen some overhere, but other move can be exploited; on the belly, on the back, on the wing, on the back of the wing? All of this in fakie? Or with a flat spin before / during / after the slide ?
Well still really lot of thing to attempt again, but I don’t think a single design can lead to all these capabilities and maybe somespecialized machines will be requiered… Like in snowboard.
Traumkumy, that’s very cool to hear that these ideas are being discussed on the French forums, too; do you have a link you can share with us?
For some time now I have been thinking about these subjects, and come up with some pretty ugly designs that might see a way forward (i.e. the Sky Skate). You are right; we might have to make concessions to a new aesthetic; or maybe not.
Is anyone discussing using 4-axis flaperon control to achieve better speed control? I have been using that arrangement on all my aerobatics gliders since 2005 or so and find it is extremely useful, especially for VTPR.
Thanks for your input – if you can share that link that would be great, as well as video of the rockslide you mention. Very cool!
Sorry Steve, but the discussion I’m refering to is not a kind of discussion with the elite of the french sloper talking about the future of sloping manoeuvers, and there is nothing more to read about.
But was only the point of view of a slope-newbye (me) comming from snowboard / skate / freestyle-kite universes, which are maybe unrealistics, but at least, to be tested.
BTW, I forgot to mention one category I would like to see explored, whom I would call “high speed stalled manoeuvers”. Which I will compare to high speed skateboard tricks, like for example, high speed impossible flips in the skate universe. The idea is for example to do a a mad flip, or the flat 360 (or a combo), not a the top of the apex when the speed is low and the garvity helps, but when the glider got most energy. The spec of the glider would look like a very compact design, with really rigid surfaces and high-torque servos. Hard to describe in a foreign language, but if you know skateboarding street tricks you should understand what I’m talking about. 😉
Last point, you goes really far in the uglyness of design in this thread 😉 But some barreers needs to be break, so it’s not a such silly way.
Nice 🙂
Well anyways, new ideas almost always have to come from outside, otherwise we just keep repeating the same things we’ve done in slope soaring for the past 30-40 years. I too come from a skate/surf/snowboard background so that is how I approach aerobatics flying, and I don’t think your ideas are unrealistic at all, and yes, I agree, to be tested!
I made a Madflip on a downline today, it worked pretty nice. Not with a lot of speed, but more than the typical version. I also accidentally did some “VTPA” (voltige tres pres du arbre) by stuffing a wingtip into the side of a tree while making a roll… pretty funny and of course I do not have it on video, but the point is that our only limitations are our imaginations… or lack of imagination, as the case may be! 🙂
Even though you say you are a newbie I bet you will progress very quickly. If you ever get a chance to record some video, please send it this way. I will enjoy seeing it, and if it’s good, of course it will be on the site!
Best regards,
Steve
You have to keep pushing the limits or risk getting bored. VTPR is a natural progression for the avid slope flyer. New designs will push our piloting skills and our flying machines aerobatic abilities.
But, having the right location and wind condition is not something everyone is fortunate to have.